Thought for Thursday

Weren’t we JUST talking about this?

“Correcting something when you put something out there that’s false seems like a matter of honor…”

“If someone who he thought was credible gave him information that he felt was credible, and he felt that he misspoke, he’d be the first person to say ‘I was wrong.'”

Except that he hasn’t done it.

Exactly who has to tell him, and exactly what does that person have to do to convince him that the FACTS are TRUE?  All that demonstrably wrong is still out there, uncorrected.

I guess, if someone doesn’t feel like being honest, well, then, who are we to tell them otherwise?

from here. The relevant bit is at the end of the clip.



Filed under critical thinking, dumbassery, fiction, frustrations, politics

10 responses to “Thought for Thursday

  1. Improbable Joe

    Well… how do you have a discussion with someone whose entire worldview comes from people who lie about everything, all the time? And who expect you to fact-check them even though they’ll probably dismiss the facts as “your opinion” or “from a biased source” or “we talk from the heart” whatever? And when you catch them in a lie outright, you can just make up a new lie and keep going.

    How is that conversation even supposed to happen? There’s a difference between “speaking from the heart” and “having convictions”, and “spreading lies and refusing to correct them.” I cut my teeth on Biblical Creationists, and they are the biggest liars on Earth… and all politically “conservative” and no coincidence. Once you’ve decided that you’re going to believe the DUMBEST STORY OF ALL TIME without doing any fact-checking or even thinking, of course you don’t mind your leaders making up the details of the fantasy land you live in. It’s all fake anyway.

  2. Sean

    Unfortunately being a career poitician and running for office has little to do with telling the truth.

    It has more to do with spoutting crap a majority of those likely to go vote believe or want to hear so they like you more than the other guy whether what they believe or want to hear is true or not.

    Our “leaders” don’t really want to lead, they just want to take us where the majority seem to think they want to go.

    And when that majority is ingorant, hateful and idiotic those of us who know better get dragged along.

    • Improbable Joe

      … mostly Republicans though. Nearly always Republicans. I’m not talking about your normal political exaggerations that are one step away from the fudging people do on job applications and their tax returns. We’re talking about statements that are the direct opposite of the truth, like claiming that taxes in America are ridiculously high when they are at historic lows and low compared to most other western countries. That’s not just spouting crap people want to hear, that’s helping to create the false reality that Republican voters live in.

  3. Improbable Joe

    Have you seen Obama’s new video for Mitt Romney? Seven lies in 84 seconds.

  4. Oh, my GOD, Joe; I JUST posted it on facebook!!

  5. Improbable Joe

    Chili-baby, I want to hear you use the word “Republican” once or twice here, OK? It seems weird that you’re talking about false equivalence and how only one side engages in these wall-to-wall lies, and the lack of naming names seems ODD, you know?

  6. I’m not going to lie, Joe; in MY personal experience, this happens FAR more often with people who call themselves Republican, conservative, or Christian than it does with people who don’t.

    Now, before some of you get all up in my face, please notice I DIDN’T say it ONLY happens with those people, but IN MY EXPERIENCE, the people who are most likely to ignore or refute demonstrable evidence, or to change the topic when the facts don’t suit them, are the people who identify as those things.

    • Improbable Joe

      But it isn’t just “your personal experience” when you’ve just called out the top two Republican candidates for President!!!!

      At some point, you’re going to have to stop engaging in your own “false equivalence”-style fallacy, and admit that Republicans in general are just really fucked up.

  7. I see what you’re saying here, Joe, but you know as well as I do that I’ve gotten myself in a world of trouble for making blanket declarations about people who identify with a group. I’m just not interested in fighting that fight again, and I have always been willing to concede that there are exceptions to every rule.

    • Improbable Joe

      Yeah, because as long as you don’t name names, things improve on their own. I’ve taken some time to think about it, but it doesn’t make any more sense to me. The point I make is that people who identify as a group that AS A GROUP engages in negative behavior have a few choices. They can choose to ignore or excuse the behavior and attack you for bringing up the behavior. They can embrace the behavior and join in the hateful behavior. Or, they can join you in attacking the behavior and say that their formerly decent group has been hijacked by extremists who they repudiate in the greatest degree.

      For instance, I often refer to Obama as an “old school Republican” or a “Nixon Republican”… and I don’t exactly mean it as an insult. Nixon, after all, signed off on the EPA and OSHA. I respect that the Republican Party used to be a patriotic center-right party that I disagree with in the highest degree but understand was based in facts and reality. I understand that there are current Republicans that don’t understand how extreme and even treasonous their party has become. I even understand… well, everything.

      You should still be able to use the word “Republican” since you’re referring to the top two Republican candidates for the presidency. The omission is a little ridiculous.

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